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241 Re: Did POB change with the times? (was Starting BATM, looking back *SPOILERS*) -- rank: 633

I'm not clear on what you're saying. Do you think I'm reading into the canon messages that aren't there, and idealizing history? I apologize if I'm being defensive. It's just that when people seem to be disagreeing with me and yet are making statements with which I wholly agree it makes me think I must be incredibly bad at expressing myself. -Hugh On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 07:49:38 -0400, Gus Spier <gus@SHIRENET.COM> wrote: >Another gratuitous opinion follows: > >In my estima ...

Poster's Name:	Hugh Yeman
Poster's Email:	Hughyeman@YAHOO.COM
Message Date:	2005-06-20 13:24:16 UTC

242 Re: Did POB change with the times? (was Starting BATM, looking back *SPOILERS*) -- rank: 633

On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 06:33:48 -0700, Chari Wessel <chari.wessel@GMAIL.COM> wrote: >I agree. In the long long history of Women as Second Class Citizens, >I believe there have always been those rebellious women who were >inclined to chafe and complain, jump the traces and bolt in various >ways--be it in challenging dinner conversation, daring social >flirtations, or breaking the "rules" entirely to become domineering >matriarchs, actresses, courtesans, cele ...

Poster's Name:	Hugh Yeman
Poster's Email:	Hughyeman@YAHOO.COM
Message Date:	2005-06-20 13:16:43 UTC

243 Re: Did POB change with the times? (was Starting BATM, looking back *SPOILERS*) -- rank: 633

I agree. In the long long history of Women as Second Class Citizens, I believe there have always been those rebellious women who were inclined to chafe and complain, jump the traces and bolt in various ways--be it in challenging dinner conversation, daring social flirtations, or breaking the "rules" entirely to become domineering matriarchs, actresses, courtesans, celebrated mistresses, cross-dressers living as men etc. etc. Novelists who are not writing Sunday School tracts u ...

Poster's Name:	Chari Wessel
Poster's Email:	chari.wessel@GMAIL.COM
Message Date:	2005-06-20 12:47:31 UTC

244 Re: Did POB change with the times? (was Starting BATM, looking back *SPOILERS*) -- rank: 633

Another gratuitous opinion follows: In my estimation, the POB portrayal of 18th and 19th century people, with all their faults, foibles, blemishes, and shining parts, is a most appealing part of the Canon. Forester (spelling?) does not do that with the Hornblower series. Cornwell does not do it with Shrpe series. I do not read into the Canon messages that are not there. English, Georgian society was simultaneously the highest and basest examples of human endeavor. These are real flesh ...

Poster's Name:	Gus Spier
Poster's Email:	gus@SHIRENET.COM
Message Date:	2005-06-20 11:03:35 UTC

245 Did POB change with the times? (was Starting BATM, looking back *SPOILERS*) -- rank: 633

Excuse me for resuming such an old thread, but I wanted to respond to this and I just haven't had the opportunity 'til now. On Fri, 10 Jun 2005 23:37:00 +0100, Sara Waterson <s.waterson@UKONLINE.CO.UK> wrote: >Hugh says of Stephen, in the course of a long post on TYA and what the >later books reveal of Jack and Stephen's relative roles in the canon: > ><< .................. His personality rejects >emotional displays >like a body re ...

Poster's Name:	Hugh Yeman
Poster's Email:	hughyeman@YAHOO.COM
Message Date:	2005-06-20 02:19:24 UTC

246 Re: Starting BATM, looking back *SPOILERS* -- rank: 633

On 6/10/05, Cathy McMann <cathymcmann@comcast.net> wrote: <snip> > I once heard an author - Elizabeth George - speak about her writing. She > originally intended her mysteries to be about one character but his sidekick > thrust himself to center stage and forced the author to make him the main > character in the series (Simon St. James and Thomas Lynley, if you have read > the books). She talked as though this was all out of her control. So I can > unders ...

Poster's Name:	Conrad Z. Risher
Poster's Email:	czrisher@GMAIL.COM
Message Date:	2005-06-11 13:39:21 UTC

247 Re: Starting BATM, looking back *SPOILERS* -- rank: 633

----- Original Message ----- From: "Sara Waterson" <s.waterson@UKONLINE.CO.UK> To: <GUNROOM@HMSSURPRISE.ORG> Sent: Friday, June 10, 2005 6:37 PM Subject: [POB] Starting BATM, looking back *SPOILERS* > Hugh says of Stephen, in the course of a long post on TYA and what the > later books reveal of Jack and Stephen's relative roles in the canon: > > << .................. His personality rejects > emotional displays > li ...

Poster's Name:	Cathy McMann
Poster's Email:	cathymcmann@COMCAST.NET
Message Date:	2005-06-10 23:30:25 UTC

248 Starting BATM, looking back *SPOILERS* -- rank: 633

Hugh says of Stephen, in the course of a long post on TYA and what the later books reveal of Jack and Stephen's relative roles in the canon: << .................. His personality rejects emotional displays like a body rejecting foreign tissue, and I believe POB is telling us that no one can do so while remaining healthy and balanced. >> I don't think this is the case at all; I think it's a misunderstanding of what is intended. Firstly, it was consid ...

Poster's Name:	Sara Waterson
Poster's Email:	s.waterson@UKONLINE.CO.UK
Message Date:	2005-06-10 21:47:59 UTC

249 Re: Starting BATM, looking back *SPOILERS* -- rank: 633

On 6/7/05, Hugh Yeman <Hughyeman@yahoo.com> wrote: ><snip long thoughtful post>> If not for Jack, Stephen would probably still have been a > successful intelligence agent and some other officer probably would have > adequately filled Jack's shoes. Assuming the other officer also managed to rescue Stephen as many times as Jack did...the scene (HMSS? Senility is setting in, sorry) where Jack threw his sword into the water afterward particularly comes to mind. I ...

Poster's Name:	Rosemary Davis
Poster's Email:	villiers@GMAIL.COM
Message Date:	2005-06-07 17:26:26 UTC

250 Re: Starting BATM, looking back *SPOILERS* -- rank: 633

Sorry, I need to correct myself: In the "geeks winning the day" paragraph I was talking about _The Yellow Admiral_, not _The Hundred Days. -Hugh

Poster's Name:	Hugh Yeman
Poster's Email:	Hughyeman@YAHOO.COM
Message Date:	2005-06-07 13:49:43 UTC

251 Starting BATM, looking back *SPOILERS* -- rank: 633

Well, I'm finally on the homestretch and I admit I'm feeling a bit of a tremor. However, the thought of actually being able to read *other books* without worrying about getting back to Jack and Stephen almost completely assuages any apprehension. I suppose I'll feel differently at the end, though. I've had some thoughts about _The Yellow Admiral_ and _The Hundred Days_ that I've hesitated to share because they could ruffle the feathers of both Jack and Stephen fans, but here goes. One o ...

Poster's Name:	Hugh Yeman
Poster's Email:	Hughyeman@YAHOO.COM
Message Date:	2005-06-07 13:40:26 UTC

252 Re: Further from Eden (BATM spoiler) -- rank: 633

On Thu, 3 Mar 2005 12:24:21 -0500, Charles Munoz <Charlezzzzz@comcast.net> wrote a brilliant longish bit, (all snipped here because I'd have to include the whole thing, or none of it, and I sympathize with the Digest readers) about myth and writers. All i can say to this is Thank You! I'm so far behind in reading I just now came across this, but what fine insight, what fine illumination! Lissuns, if you missed it, go back! All the chatter on this list makes us friends but the occ ...

Poster's Name:	Rowen 84
Poster's Email:	rowen.84@GMAIL.COM
Message Date:	2005-03-07 15:46:49 UTC

253 Re: Further from Eden (BATM spoiler) -- rank: 633

On Mar 3, 2005, at 10:34 AM, Stolzi wrote: > What about the Deluge, Charlezzzz? That comes right in there not too > far > after the Eden story. Noah and the rest must also have felt "that > the sky > could not hold so much." Ah, the deluge, the flood. My favorite flood story is in Gilgamesh. Gilgamesh is having an ark built and is having trouble building it right. He gets a carpenter to finish it up for him. He pays the man by telling him that he can tak ...

Poster's Name:	Charles Munoz
Poster's Email:	Charlezzzzz@COMCAST.NET
Message Date:	2005-03-03 18:14:21 UTC

254 Re: Further from Eden (BATM spoiler) -- rank: 633

----- Original Message ----- From: "Charles Munoz" <Charlezzzzz@COMCAST.NET> > > [Monsters left astern, Surprise is back in the "normal" world, and I > think references to the Eden story have ended, at least for a while.] What about the Deluge, Charlezzzz? That comes right in there not too far after the Eden story. Noah and the rest must also have felt "that the sky could not hold so much." "water ... clean and pure...." from &quo ...

Poster's Name:	Stolzi
Poster's Email:	Stolzi@COMCAST.NET
Message Date:	2005-03-03 17:15:44 UTC

255 Re: More on Maturin's sad Eden (BATM spoiler) -- rank: 633

No spoilers below as they were snipped. I am agape too Charlezzzz at POB and your great find. I can't find a thread on this as I'm a little ahoo, with the ship careened there for a while. Post of the Week! A stellar week, too. I am sure we are entering a wonderful new era in the Gunroom. Huzzah for our List Bard, huzzah for the Admins, and all the ship's company, and our blessed Harbormaster. ~~ Linnea Charlezzzzz wrote: Date: Sat Feb 26 2005 - 21:13:07 EST Spoilers for Blue at the Mi ...

Poster's Name:	Linnea
Poster's Email:	ronlin@BRINET.COM
Message Date:	2005-02-28 17:50:54 UTC